Socialized Medicine = National Healthcare?

Positives..I have seen it work in Canada. Basic coverage so all get a certain amount of care and preventative medicine. Eliminates the overuse of emergency rooms for chronic conditions and actually saves some money with early intervention.

Negatives...They are not always prepared for catastrophic treatments like cancers, heart transplants etc. Not as many MRI machines so you wait your turn. Not as many high dollar specialists as they don't get so much more than GP's like here. If someone needs expensive cancer treatments the wait may take too long for the patient to survive the illness...or if they have the money, they can' go to another country [like USA] and buy the catastrophic treatment.

So it gives everyone a baseline of care but it doesn't invest in the individual who needs extraordinary care...but that's socialism. Take care of everyone equally but not completely if they need/want extra. For example...Medicare for elderly. It works. Not perfect and some choose to buy additional coverage when they want more. Why not make that for entire population and not just the elderly???? That way all would have some and those who want more can buy it.

Off topic...but I can't let the education thing slide by without a comment. Since end of the cold war and space race, MANY in the US including many in the government, have not been engaged in being the best as far as education goes. Once we were no longer in a competition with USSR, we started to sit back on our laurels with our feet up. Funding was cut for science and research projects because we thought we were no longer in competition. For a full generation, we have rested on those laurels and now many other countries have caught up to us and some have passed us. We need to get back into the mode of being in competition scientifically and economically. To be "good enough" or as good as the last generation were falsehoods because we were feeling good about beating the Russians.

Some now are waking up to see that the race was still going on all along but we just stopped to take a break like the tortoise and the hare....The hare [USA] was out in front so far that we decided we could afford to take a nap. We slept too long. The various tortoises [China and India for examples] are ahead of us in some respects.

ALL of our students, ALL of our teachers, and ALL of our parents and other tax payers need to get their heads back into the race and realize we need to be the best we are able to be or each of us will lose. If too many lose, it will mean our country loses. Wake UP people! I have complained about things that are wrong about our educational system both local and national, BUT [triple big but] we EACH need to use FULLY what we have for school NOW. Each parent MAKE each student take the HARDEST courses he is able to and as many as he is able to so he can get as far up the academic ladder as he can go. Just because our school isn't perfect doesn't mean we don't pay attention to what we can get out of it.

School isn't there to be easy. Only when one is challenged will they learn. Too many are taking EASY math so they don't have to work hard. Too many are working at fast food place to support a car instead of using that time to study so that they can be in the race for a better job. Parents pay for school buses via taxes and then let their kids trade off study time to work so they can spend money to buy and support a car instead of using the time to study so they can succeed in higher level classes. This trading away their future for a car...?

When Dr Bill Cosby wrote the book COME ON PEOPLE, he was mainly talking to blacks in our society who were just sliding along thinking that society owed them something but I feel he should have been addressing all of us. Get engaged. You will fail if you don't take challenging courses and don't put time into doing well in them. Your primary job is to get educated, not to work as a bag boy at Kroger. In other words, you can't blame the schools if you aren't using them to their fullest. Here in Clay county too many are not as we are having a hard time keeping the higher level courses full. I'll quit here as it's really not the purpose of this blog. It's all about choices though. Healthcare or education. All linked and too many making wrong choices at many levels. There is no EASY button. It all takes money and hard work.

Canada and Great Britain are good examples of the resulting rationing of care that a socialized medical care system creates. Ms Moore neglected to elaborate that many hospitals have closed since its inception in Canada. Physician numbers are down drasticly as well. Why go into such demanding fields of study to come out to work for the government dictated wage?

Question. If the Canadians come here, when they can't get treatment there, because of scarce services....where will WE have to go to get sevices when we have that system here?

If you think health care is costly now, wait till you get sick....when it's free.

I will try to find you some sites later, but NO ONE will be denied medical treatment that is needed. We have MediCad for the state. Some choose NOT to have it, mainly because of the cost but mostly because they weigh the cost and opt not to carry it because of their age (20's-30's).

Now the real question. Do you want the government (big brother) not only knowing what medications you are on, but being able to tell the doctor what you can be on, and what procedures you can or cannot have. This is fact what happens in socilaized medicine. It is not all about the money, but also the quality. If a Doctor is going to make the same amount of money treating the common cold versus brain surgery, (exaggereted for effect), why would he be excited about spending more time with one than the other. Socialized medicine is a black hole we do not want to go down.

We all have heard horror stories but those are anomolies. But if we go down that road, they will be common. Promise.

Right now, Americans rate the quality of their health care higher than any other country. Currently, there are enough physicians to provide high quality health care to 250 million Americans (roughly 80% of the population.) Under universal health care another 50 million more people will be added to the system. There simply are not enough physicians to maintain the current high level of care under a universal health care scheme.

It is my understanding that in England it is not possible to negotiate for better care. The baseline is the only option. We may not be able to just pay more for better healthcare on a socialized plan.

Currently, the medical tourism industry is booming in places like India and Thailand. I predict that if socialized healthcare is adopted here, the Caribbean will become a hot destination for procedures not available here.

Anodos:

While Americans surveyed may rate their health care as high, I suggest visiting St Ann Clinic right in Terre Haute and see what many do NOT have that the Sisters of Providence are trying to give to those who have fallen through the cracks.

The hard question we have to ask ourselves is..

Which is better? Are the people with high quality health care willing to give a portion of it up in order for ALL to get at least to get baseline coverage? It is the same with the starving peoples in the world. There is enough to go around but those who have will have less if we choose to share.

It is not the choice for those who have not but an ethical and moral decision for those who have. I contend it is not an argument about how perfect or imperfect it may become. While "we" [general term, not towards people in this discussion]go to doctors for impotence, infertility and help with weight loss, much covered by insurance, others are dieing from nutritional disease and lack of immunizations.

Yes we also may loose more loved ones from cancer and liver failure, but can we ignore the others who die/suffer each day from diseases easily prevented because they have nothing? Yes definitely socialized medicine but each has to give their own answer. We are our brother's keepers. Is there some middle ground? Is their some sort of way we can make sure it isn't taken advantage of as Habitat does with "sweat equity" when a person gets a house built for them?

Hard questions I think.

http://www.nchc.org/facts/cost.shtml

An interesting link I just received via email. Thought it would be an interesting read.

KM.

Dear Edward,

Those who are being interviewed within the Brazil Justice and Legal, Criminal Justice and City Hall have very busy schedules. They have tried their best to fit me in, however, these things take time. I am meeting with them out of order, but the first series should be up by Friday of next week. Thanks for your inquiry and thanks for reading my blog! I hope you have a fantastic weekend!

KM.

Great post localguy from practical real experience. Listen to his words well. I don't know if you have experienced this but my Doctor got a note once suggesting alternative medicines for a new prescription he had put me on. He threw it away. With socialized medicine, the government won't ask, they will just automatically send you whatever drug THEY think you should take. I personally started on Lipitor, but I couldn't take the leg pains, then I went on Pravastatin, same thing. Now I take Crestor which seems to be working out. But with socialized medicine, you will be taking the one that is the cheapest, and the government will put you on a dietary program. Not necessarily a bad idea, but certainly NO business of big brother. When you allow them to "pay" for your treatment, then they think that they should have some input into that treatment. Personally, I have worked for the government, NO THANK YOU, I would prefer the current system vs government involvement of any kind.

Then think about what is going to happen within the medical profession. Doctors will be retiring in droves. Medical colleges will be hard pressed to fill up their class rooms. TREATMENT WILL GO DOWN THE TUBES.

Sure there are isolated cases in other countries that have socialized medicine, where someone got good care. Or where someone who was not covered is now covered. But when it is YOU, you don't care that it is an isolated case. You want the best treatment. With socialized medicine, you will have to go out of country, where our Doctors migrated to, to get that treatment.

Can you show me one case where a person who was in dire need of medical attention, was turned down by ANY doctor or hospital? If you go into an emergency room with a knife stuck in your back (medifore), would they refuse to treat you? Of course not. Regardless of you ability to pay. The people that are on MediCade (State Insurance) are not uninsured. The state of Indiana has insured them. Now if you have a cold, or some sort of a rash, then yes, you maybe denied services.

I once saw a Doctor who asked a patient that showed up in the office, to go elsewhere for treatment. I suppose that was the Doctors perogative. There are other Doctors in town, or even Terre Haute.

With the SCHIP bill now passed (1st step to socialized medicine) we now theoritically have people that make 40K, paying for a childs health care, whose parent might make 90K. Now that is change I can believe in. NOT.

Becareful what you ask for, you just might get it.

Conservative Dad:

We have same concerns on this I think. Just playing devil's advocate here...Continue to cover the children who do not have any real choice in the matter...but what does that do to them if their parent/guardian is ill or dies due to lack of health care, even if they have made poor choices?

When do we turn away from those in need for fear of giving those ho could do for themselves were getting a free ride? This is seriously a tough decision for all concerned, personally and those who set the regulations. No easy button here.

Conservative Dad:

Then why are there so many going to St Ann clinic for help for both general health and dental care?

The staff there checks to make sure that there are no other programs for them before treatment. They just don't take anyone who walks in...If that were the case you and I could go there even though we may be insured?

We have too many working poor who do not have insurance and do not qualify for medicaid. Then there is the choice thing....Some politicians actually suggested an allowance going to all so that they may purchase their own coverage but what happens when a dad is faced with the choice of buying groceries or shoes for his child or paying that monthly premium? Which is the more immediate need? Like the elderly who aren't buying their prescriptions as they use the money for groceries. Something needs to be done so these choices are mute.

Those who are uninsured by choice are one thing, those who have no choice are the ones I am talking about. Are we as a population willing to have our health care reduced in order to have others have a basic coverage?

Yes it will cost and yes it may reduce our coverage.

The same question may be asked about general poverty in the world. If we REALLY tithed to help our fellow man as we were taught to do by our faith, we would give up the video games, the TV's, the status symbol SUV's and BMW's and donate more to organizations like heifer project and habitat for humanity. Are we willing to give up some of our wants so others can get some of their needs? We think we need these computers we are posting on, need the microwave ovens, need the George Foreman grills, and the new car every three years. Have we gotten our wants and needs confused and put our wants over our fellow man's needs? I know I could do more to equalize the living standards of others so it's not an accusal to any specific person. Just something for us all to consider. It's not an us and them when you think of all of us on earth being of one family.

Yes some will take advantage of the system just as they do now. Some will divert our donations to benefit themselves. This happens now and always will, but that is not an excuse to not try to make it better for some who cannot help themselves.